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Thread: YAH'S Calendar In The Heavens Genesis 1:14.

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliyah View Post
    You simply choose anything outside of scriptures that fits your ideas, Ken.

    Sence= see every verse how its used here....http://www.blbclassic.org/search/tra...e&page=3&t=KJV

    apo G575
    1.of separation

    1.of local separation, after verbs of motion from a place i.e. of departing, of fleeing, ...


    2.of separation of a part from the whole

    1.where of a whole some part is taken

    3.of any kind of separation of one thing from another by which the union or fellowship of the two is destroyed

    4.of a state of separation, that is of distance

    1.physical, of distance of place

    2.temporal, of distance of time

    2.of origin

    Your words are not in the text. Now, answer my question with a scriptural answer: Please show me a scriptural text that says, the Sabbath day is the third day??

    Either show me, or concede the point, and we will move on.
    Shalom Eliyahu C, if anyone needs to concede, I would think it would be you. First, the Greek word G575 is used 671 times in the Authorized Version, and the majority of instances use "from," which lines up perfectly with how they meant that "today LEADS the third day FROM when these things were done." The Greek word G575 is only translated "since" FIVE times out of the 671, and on each occasion, FROM could be used instead. Here is the list of how G575 is translated in the AV:

    AV from 393, of 129, out of 48, for 10, off 10, by 9, at 9, in 6, since + 3739 5, on 5, not tr. 16, misc. 31

    But where you really have a problem with looking closely at the Greek is G71. Of the 72 instances in the AV where G71 is used, "IS" is ONLY used ONE time, and it is at Luke 24:21. That should speak volumes to you.

    And I know that you do not like looking at "extra" biblical texts, but Rome in destroying a lot of Truth, was very selective in choosing what they destroyed and what they authorized. As I said before, I wouldn't necessarily believe or agree with every word that is found within the "Gospel of the Holy Twelve," but to me it is quite remarkable that this ancient manuscript was talked about by the early church fathers as mentioned here (and I haven't personally tried to verify this):

    "The Christian scriptures that failed to be admitted into the Bible were then outlawed, collected, and destroyed.

    Prior to 325 AD, however, many of the early Church fathers had included in their writings mention of an earlier Gospel, upon which they claimed in near-perfect unison, the synoptic Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke had all been based. Mentioned or quoted from by such well-known church fathers as Papias, Hegesippus, Iranaeas, Clement, Origen, Basil, Epiphanius, Eusebius, and St. Jerome, this document had gone variously by the title "Gospel of the Nazirenes" (The word "Nazirene" comes from the "Nazirite-Essene" sect, or a Nazirite sect of the Essene branch of Judaism), "Gospel of the Hebrews", "Gospel of the Ebionites", and "The Aramaic Gospel of Matthew".

    For nearly 2,000 years, historians considered this work to have been irrevocably lost, but in 1870 a forgotten copy was discovered, hidden away in a Tibetan monastery, and was quickly translated from the original Aramaic, published this time as "The Gospel of the Holy Twelve". This work was translated into the old-style King James English by Rev. G.J.R. Ouseley. The work was quickly rejected however, and considered blasphemous by the Church."


    Again, like I have said, not everything written in the Gospel of the Holy Twelve is something that I could agree with, but it's version of Luke 24:21 is something I could agree with:

    "5. And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth who was a Prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people; and how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him to be condemned to death, and have crucified him. But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel; and beside all this three days have passed since these things were done."

    Do you see that Eliyahu? Three days have passed SINCE these things were done. I would think that you would accept this rendering SINCE the word "since" is used. So the witnesses are mounting up against YOUR logic and reasoning. I would concede if I were you. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.

  2. #47
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    Question Let's back up here!

    Again I have to laugh, because you started off by saying I was a 1 year old, and its you who are acting like a 1 year old with your very actions on this forum, and again you purposely break down the communication process here. I will address your posting here later, but I want to see if I'm dealing with a 1 year old here. YOU completely ignored the scriptural texts I gave yesterday. Your adding to the texts of scriptures here Ken, and your going on other forums doing it too.

    Now show me where this here τέταρτος Greek word is used in the Luke 24:21 text??

    Let's back up to yesterday: You said quote....
    He rose RIGHT at the BEGINNING of the 1st day of the week, AT SUNSET, as the weekly Sabbath was ending.
    I asked...Now show me the text or texts that say, He rose on the Sabbath day? Now please, either put it-that text of scripture up, or shut up saying things the scriptural texts do NOT say.

    This is FAR from me conceding to your error.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliyah View Post
    Again I have to laugh, because you started off by saying I was a 1 year old, and its you who are acting like a 1 year old with your very actions on this forum, and again you purposely break down the communication process here. I will address your posting here later, but I want to see if I'm dealing with a 1 year old here. YOU completely ignored the scriptural texts I gave yesterday. Your adding to the texts of scriptures here Ken, and your going on other forums doing it too.

    Now show me where this here τέταρτος Greek word is used in the Luke 24:21 text??

    Let's back up to yesterday: You said quote.... I asked...Now show me the text or texts that say, He rose on the Sabbath day? Now please, either put it-that text of scripture up, or shut up saying things the scriptural texts do NOT say.

    This is FAR from me conceding to your error.
    Shalom Eliyahu C, that Greek word is not used in Luke 24:21. You are just trying to make a point that is pointless. If I tell you that today leads the third day away, then a logical and reasonable mind would figure out that today IS the fourth day, and NOT the third day, so it wouldn't be necessary to make any mention of τέταρτος in my statement.

    As far as showing you the text? If you really want to argue the point, I will say that He rose as the 1st day of the week was beginning (at sunset). Does that make you happy? You see, at the time He rose, it was BETWEEN the eves (our Saturday evening, right as the 1st day of the week begins), so if you really demand it, I will say that he rose right as the 1st day of the week was beginning, instead of saying that He rose right as the Sabbath was ending. So I hope that will make you happy, and help in your understanding.

    Now, please address the fact that the Greek word G71 is ONLY translated "IS" ONCE, out of 72 times. Is this not a BLATANT mistranslation of this Greek word to try to make it say something that it does not mean?

    Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImAHebrew View Post
    Shalom Eliyahu C, that Greek word is not used in Luke 24:21. You are just trying to make a point that is pointless. If I tell you that today leads the third day away, then a logical and reasonable mind would figure out that today IS the fourth day, and NOT the third day, so it wouldn't be necessary to make any mention of τέταρτος in my statement.

    As far as showing you the text? If you really want to argue the point, I will say that He rose as the 1st day of the week was beginning (at sunset). Does that make you happy? You see, at the time He rose, it was BETWEEN the eves (our Saturday evening, right as the 1st day of the week begins), so if you really demand it, I will say that he rose right as the 1st day of the week was beginning, instead of saying that He rose right as the Sabbath was ending. So I hope that will make you happy, and help in your understanding.

    Now, please address the fact that the Greek word G71 is ONLY translated "IS" ONCE, out of 72 times. Is this not a BLATANT mistranslation of this Greek word to try to make it say something that it does not mean?

    Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
    Shalom Eliyahu C, that Greek word is not used in Luke 24:21.
    The word "FOURTH" and the word "AWAY" is NOT in this text either. Then WHY are YOU saying it is used in this text on other forums? The words third day does NOT mean fourth day, and this IS what you are still saying quote..
    If I tell you that today leads the third day away, then a logical and reasonable mind would figure out that today IS the fourth day, and NOT the third day, so it wouldn't be necessary to make any mention of τέταρτος in my statement.
    Now that's IS a joke, its funny, and its a contradiction Ken. Do you really tell people, that "the day after to morrow, which is the third day" that it means the "fourth day"?? Really?? People will think your stupid, if you do that, its confusion!

    Like your contradictory statement of Mark 16:2 Its BOTH the first day of the week, and its not, and its another Sabbath day, and its referring to the first day of the week right? Laugh...

    The word to day-this very day is plainly in this Luke 24:21 text, and you ignore it, which precedes a primary Greek verb "led=is G71" and every translator, translates a Greek verb into an English verb, so an educated person can understand it, and the words "third=Greek Tritos day" is followed after G71, not the word "fourth" as you are claiming either. Also, G71 is "led" NOT "lead" as you are claiming either, and there is a mistranslation of this word "lead" as G71 ONLY ONE TIME in Mark 13:11. Now, you tell me, WHY did Mark use the G71 "led" in Mark 13:11 in the Greek text?

    Do I have to show you every other English translation on Luke 24:21? All these translations agree on this text, and the word "AWAY" is NOT in this text as you say either.

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    Oh, the word "TODAY" he's blind to it, its not there for Ken, and" the third day " don't really mean the "third day" as the text plainly says, it means the "fourth day"?? And then, he admits, the word "fourth " is NOT in this text, but then again to Ken, it means "the fourth day"?? What contradictions he makes. Really? Laugh..

  6. #51
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    Ken said..
    If I tell you that today leads the third day away, then a logical and reasonable mind would figure out that today IS the fourth day, and NOT the third day, so it wouldn't be necessary to make any mention of τέταρτος in my statement.
    So, the "THIRD DAY" really means the "FOURTH DAY" even if this word "FOURTH" is not even used in this text?? You don't tell someone, " TODAY leads the third day away" , and means "the FOURTH DAY"(Really? Do you tell people this?) and why should anyone have to figure anything out??

    TODAY, is either the 1st day, the 2nd day, or the 3rd day, but, the "3rd day" does NOT mean the "4th day" either.

  7. #52
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    Question

    Show me examples anywhere in the scriptures, where "THE THIRD DAY" means "THE FOURTH DAY"??

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliyah View Post
    The word "FOURTH" and the word "AWAY" is NOT in this text either. Then WHY are YOU saying it is used in this text on other forums? The words third day does NOT mean fourth day, and this IS what you are still saying quote.. Now that's IS a joke, its funny, and its a contradiction Ken. Do you really tell people, that "the day after to morrow, which is the third day" that it means the "fourth day"?? Really?? People will think your stupid, if you do that, its confusion!

    Like your contradictory statement of Mark 16:2 Its BOTH the first day of the week, and its not, and its another Sabbath day, and its referring to the first day of the week right? Laugh...

    The word to day-this very day is plainly in this Luke 24:21 text, and you ignore it, which precedes a primary Greek verb "led=is G71" and every translator, translates a Greek verb into an English verb, so an educated person can understand it, and the words "third=Greek Tritos day" is followed after G71, not the word "fourth" as you are claiming either. Also, G71 is "led" NOT "lead" as you are claiming either, and there is a mistranslation of this word "lead" as G71 ONLY ONE TIME in Mark 13:11. Now, you tell me, WHY did Mark use the G71 "led" in Mark 13:11 in the Greek text?

    Do I have to show you every other English translation on Luke 24:21? All these translations agree on this text, and the word "AWAY" is NOT in this text as you say either.
    Shalom Eliyah C. do you believe the translators were correct in translating G3957 as "Easter?" Do you think that they had a "presupposition" to change the Greek word πάσχα (paskha) from Passover to Easter? Or do you believe the translators were correct in letting their prejudice change the actual word from what it meant to what they wanted it to mean? The same thing happened with G71, and it is undeniable. G71 does NOT mean "IS." Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliyah View Post
    Ken said.. So, the "THIRD DAY" really means the "FOURTH DAY" even if this word "FOURTH" is not even used in this text?? You don't tell someone, " TODAY leads the third day away" , and means "the FOURTH DAY"(Really? Do you tell people this?) and why should anyone have to figure anything out??

    TODAY, is either the 1st day, the 2nd day, or the 3rd day, but, the "3rd day" does NOT mean the "4th day" either.
    Shalom Eliyahu C, it appears you are hung up on the use of words. It is not saying that TODAY "IS" the third day. That is not what the verse is saying. It is saying that "Today" was LEADING the third day away, and the Greek word G575, means "away" or "from," so TODAY leads the third day AWAY or FROM when those things took place. Why is this so hard for you to comprehend?

    It's very simple Eliyahu. Yeshua was placed in the tomb RIGHT AT SUNSET, as the High Day was beginning, and THREE DAYS and THREE NIGHTS later, He rose. What is so difficult to understand about that?

    Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImAHebrew View Post
    Shalom Eliyahu C, it appears you are hung up on the use of words. It is not saying that TODAY "IS" the third day. That is not what the verse is saying. It is saying that "Today" was LEADING the third day away, and the Greek word G575, means "away" or "from," so TODAY leads the third day AWAY or FROM when those things took place. Why is this so hard for you to comprehend?

    It's very simple Eliyahu. Yeshua was placed in the tomb RIGHT AT SUNSET, as the High Day was beginning, and THREE DAYS and THREE NIGHTS later, He rose. What is so difficult to understand about that?

    Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
    I'm not hung up on any words, you hang yourself with your own words by contradicting yourself. I asked YOU a question: Show me scriptural examples, where the words "THE THIRD DAY" means "THE FOURTH DAY"??

  11. #56
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    Smile

    Man I have to laugh, you tell people to meet you ON THE THIRD DAY but then it really means "THE FOURTH DAY? Really? Do you do that in real life? Laugh..

  12. #57
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    Smile

    Then let's change every place that says "the third day" to mean "the fourth day" so everyone has to figure it out, Right? Laugh..

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    Smile

    Laugh..LOL

  14. #59
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    The words "third day" (3rd day) is used in Luke 24:21, and NOT "fourth day"(4th day), the Disciple Luke would have used the word "fourth" here, if it were the 4th day. And we know this is still the first day of the week in this text, because John 20:19 along with Luke 24:35-46 tells us it is, plain and simple.

    Even in Ken's reckoning, the 4th day does not start until evening at sunset, NOT in the afternoon.

    We are not to "change the texts" nor are we to "add anything" into the texts of scriptures. This IS why I called Ken a liar on the other thread, because the scriptures calls him a liar, it calls anyone a liar. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. Proverbs 30:6.

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    Question Today The 3rd day or the 4th day?

    The Roman week. Is today the 3rd day or the 4th day?

    Tuesday, Today leads the third day away since Sunday, so that really makes this day the 4th day since Sunday, the first day of the Roman week.(Really?) Of course, isn't all of this very logical common sense?? Is today really the 4th day since Sunday, of this Roman week, or, is today really the 3rd day since Sunday, of this Roman week?

    Hey Ken, be sure to tell everyone, that today leads the third day away since Sunday, and that this day is really the fourth day since Sunday, and its not really the 3rd day of the week. Ok?

    Ken will say, NO, NO, today is the 4th day of the week, its not really the 3rd day of the week!Right? Really? Now you talk about being a one year old, this is one year old logic. Laugh..

    Have a nice 4th day at work today.

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